-- Wii System Update 4.2 Mega Topic --

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poepoog

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WaxyPumpkin72
Lol, I don't really get it either. Probably some inside joke. :P

JODI : Jodi Daugherty, Nintendo’s senior director for anti-piracy.

i dont think tt should have released the title id so nintendo couldnt patch it

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poepoog

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WaxyPumpkin72
Lol, I don't really get it either. Probably some inside joke. :P

JODI : Jodi Daugherty, Nintendo’s senior director for anti-piracy.

Lol, okay! :D



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/02/2009 04:45AM by WaxyPumpkin72.

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poepoog

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WaxyPumpkin72
Lol, I don't really get it either. Probably some inside joke. :P

JODI : Jodi Daugherty, Nintendo’s senior director for anti-piracy.

That's hularious xD

I understand this would take some collaboration, but if we want to 'beat' ninty on this so that they don't just release another update that looks for JODI, I think this would work.

Every homebrew app 'knows' it is written for Homebrew, and I believe used to look for the title of HAXX to switch back to when it exited. This has obviously now been changed, and so all the apps will need to be updated, and chances are this cycle will keep repeating with each Ninty update Vs Homebrew Update.

How about rather than using a FIXED title id for HBC it instead supported either letting users set their own title Id, or else used a random one.
Obvioulsy then you get the issue of how the apps know the title Id of homebrew...
HBC should have a feature to check the Apps folder of the SD card (or whatever), and be able to 'push' it's new title ID into each of the apps on there.
I realise this means that each & every homebrew app would need to be updated to support this function, (to 'listen' for the new title ID), but as I understand it they are all going to need to be updated ANYWAY to look for the new title ID of HBC now.

Using a fixed title ID will just cause a continuous cycle I would think, but effective making it so that every HBC on every Wii had a unique title ID may make things more 'interesting'...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/02/2009 11:08AM by Schmill.

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Every homebrew app 'knows' it is written for Homebrew, and I believe used to look for the title of HAXX to switch back to when it exited. This has obviously now been changed, and so all the apps will need to be updated, and chances are this cycle will keep repeating with each Ninty update Vs Homebrew Update.

What is the issue at hand here?
I updatd the HBC and all my apps keep working normally and revert back to HBC when they quit.

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Schmill
Every homebrew app 'knows' it is written for Homebrew, and I believe used to look for the title of HAXX to switch back to when it exited.

I don't believe that's how it works. In the tutorial's I've been working through it's been determined by exit codes.

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swirleydude

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Schmill
Every homebrew app 'knows' it is written for Homebrew, and I believe used to look for the title of HAXX to switch back to when it exited.

I don't believe that's how it works. In the tutorial's I've been working through it's been determined by exit codes.

This is correct. Apps use a return stub, not a channel loader loading HAXX. Return stubs were functional before channel loading had been worked out. Also, returning to loader works on any loader, not just HBC, so obviously it doesnt just load HAXX. Therefore, apps can easily return to HBC without needing to be updated despite title ID change.

The main issue with not using fixed ID is, I think, preloader. It loads HAXX, and therefore must be updated to load JODI instead. However, thats not really twiizers concern (although they dont purposefully make it hard for apps like preloader to function).

But a random title ID would be a bad idea. In this case, things like preloader could not function, as it would be a random title ID and it wouldnt know what to load. And if there is a file ANYWHERE (SD or NAND) telling it the title ID generated, the System Menu could find that file and delete the title ID in it.

So I would say that allowing users to choose a title ID would probably be a better option.Then they could type it into preloader themselves. However, it would still be stored somewhere by preloader, so System Menu could still find and block it. But, the only thing which would need the file is preloader, and if you have preloader, you can bypass the HBC and DVX blocks with a hacks.ini. So therefore, this may be a good idea.

So for that reason, I feel the best option would be to have HackMii Installer patch out the HBC checks from System Menu, instead of just installing HBC with a different title ID. It wouldn't be hard, they would just have to patch the preloader hack into the System Menu in the sort of way things like StarFall do, using their secret IOS exploit. Then they wouldnt have to bother changing the title IDs every update, people could just run HackMii Installer and patch their System Menu to allow HBC and DVDx, then install them. I'd say this would be easier.

However, they would have to find the offset in future system menus, which Nintendo could probably make harder. So maybe the best solution would be just to let the user select the title ID, and then ask crediar nicely to update preloader to let you manually enter the HBC title ID.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/02/2009 07:37PM by SifJar.

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TheManuel
What is the issue at hand here?

Any homebrew that uses the HAXX or DVDX titles will have to be updated to use the new titles - or else said homebrew will not function correctly. Honestly, I can't think of any homebrew besides BootMii (which has already been updated) that uses HAXX.

Amazing idea. It will be like going into witness protection. XD

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Arikado

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TheManuel
What is the issue at hand here?

Any homebrew that uses the HAXX or DVDX titles will have to be updated to use the new titles - or else said homebrew will not function correctly. Honestly, I can't think of any homebrew besides BootMii (which has already been updated) that uses HAXX.

preloader. I believe that is the only other one.

preloader needs to be updated... Someone bug crediar to release the source or update it!

My app Crazy Intro too relies on the title id of the Homebrew Channel...

Though I didn't need an update since I read the title id of the homebrew channel from a configuration file. Just replacing HAXX with JODI suffices.

For the general matter, it's worst for DVDX actually... all the applications that use it must be recompiled, packaged, distributed... insane amount of work...

@SifJar : Patching trick will not work since not everyone is able to install bootmii into a boot2 slot.

Random title id should be the way to go but then Nintendo may came up with deleting all trucha-signed content...

Nowhere to hide from Nintendo unless their private keys are compromised unless we are patching or replacing the system menu all together or finding a nasty bug in fixed boot1 versions.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/02/2009 09:57PM by I.R.on.

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I.R.on
My app Crazy Intro too relies on the title id of the Homebrew Channel...

Though I didn't need an update since I read the title id of the homebrew channel from a configuration file. Just replacing HAXX with JODI suffices.

That's why I didn't mention it

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I.R.on
For the general matter, it's worst for DVDX actually... all the applications that use it must be recompiled, packaged, distributed... insane amount of work...

Apparently, this will only need to happen once, as there is now code which will find DVDx regardless of title ID, so apps compiled now wont need to be recompiled when there is yet another title ID change of DVDx, which is bound to have to happen

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I.R.on
@SifJar : Patching trick will not work since not everyone is able to install bootmii into a boot2 slot.

I dont understand what you mean? Why does BootMii have to be installed to boot2 for System Menu patch? The HackMii Installer could just install the patch, in the same way apps like StarFall or StartPatch do. StartPatch works on wiis which cant install BootMii as boot2, why couldn't this?

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I.R.on
Random title id should be the way to go but then Nintendo may came up with deleting all trucha-signed content...

Nowhere to hide from Nintendo unless their private keys are compromised unless we are patching or replacing the system menu all together or finding a nasty bug in fixed boot1 versions.

I'd say random title ID or having user select their own title ID would be best option, but there'd have to be a few checks in place to make sure you dont overwrite anything important. i.e dont allow title IDs starting with any of the following letters, which are used by actual channels : C,D,E,F,H,L,M,N,P,Q,R,W,X

I guess thats obvious though. Anyway, I'm sure Team Twiizers will do what's best and manage to get around Nintendo's updates well.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/02/2009 11:20PM by SifJar.

It will be interesting to see what Nintendo does to recover from the 4.2 update bricking issue. I don't know how many Wiis were affected by the buggy boot2 update code, but it has to be costing Nintendo a lot of money to fix bricked un-modified Wiis for free. Most likely, they'll soon come up with a 4.3 update that fixes the boot2 update code and also searches for the newer versions of the HBC and DVDx. It would be good for TT to come up with a good way to custom name the title ids for HBC and DVDx, making it harder for Nintendo to remove them in a future update. I'm just surprised at how long it actually took Nintendo to try and remove the HBC. They could have easily made a patch to remove the HBC a while ago. Alas, the cat and mouse game continues.

I don't understand why Ninty is fighting a battle that we all know they can't win. Seriously, it would take a heck of a long time for Nintendo to find and patch every last bug in their software. Plus I don't see how they could do much more to stop us (legally anyway)

Can they even prevent SmashStack or Indiana Pwns from working?

Just curious, is it known (for anyone that has updated to 4.2) if the Wii Shop Channel is any different?

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musicalmatt
Just curious, is it known (for anyone that has updated to 4.2) if the Wii Shop Channel is any different?

The ring at the top left looks thinner when a page is loading.

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musicalmatt
Just curious, is it known (for anyone that has updated to 4.2) if the Wii Shop Channel is any different?

You can get the updated Shop Channel on 4.1 or lower with WiiSCU.

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SifJar

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I.R.on
For the general matter, it's worst for DVDX actually... all the applications that use it must be recompiled, packaged, distributed... insane amount of work...

Apparently, this will only need to happen once, as there is now code which will find DVDx regardless of title ID, so apps compiled now wont need to be recompiled when there is yet another title ID change of DVDx, which is bound to have to happen

Hmm, didn't know that... so emus now can read from dvd regardless of the 4.2 update by nintendo? (with the new dvdx installation afterwards of course)

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SifJar

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I.R.on
@SifJar : Patching trick will not work since not everyone is able to install bootmii into a boot2 slot.

I dont understand what you mean? Why does BootMii have to be installed to boot2 for System Menu patch? The HackMii Installer could just install the patch, in the same way apps like StarFall or StartPatch do. StartPatch works on wiis which cant install BootMii as boot2, why couldn't this?


I'd say random title ID or having user select their own title ID would be best option, but there'd have to be a few checks in place to make sure you dont overwrite anything important. i.e dont allow title IDs starting with any of the following letters, which are used by actual channels : C,D,E,F,H,L,M,N,P,Q,R,W,X

I guess thats obvious though. Anyway, I'm sure Team Twiizers will do what's best and manage to get around Nintendo's updates well.

Well I meant temporary patching since TT is always against permanent patching... bootmii is the best option for temporary patching yet as I said it's not available for everyone... Patching is messy, if everyone had bootmii it would be a viable solution though...

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I.R.on

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SifJar

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I.R.on
For the general matter, it's worst for DVDX actually... all the applications that use it must be recompiled, packaged, distributed... insane amount of work...

Apparently, this will only need to happen once, as there is now code which will find DVDx regardless of title ID, so apps compiled now wont need to be recompiled when there is yet another title ID change of DVDx, which is bound to have to happen

Hmm, didn't know that... so emus now can read from dvd regardless of the 4.2 update by nintendo? (with the new dvdx installation afterwards of course)

No, they still need to be recompiled for THIS title ID change (DVDX > DISC), but if they are compiled now, they will automatically work with any FUTURE title ID changes.